Well, you have the illustrations...in both cases the ground slopes away from your feet to the ball...the difference would be that, on the one hand, the ground is sloping away from the target and, on the other, sloping towards it. In the first case you would take dead aim and in the second case you would aim left of the target...it's all explained in the link you provided. What's confusing you?
How come the ball below the feet but it is uphill lie?
Now that I see the illustration, it appears they are saying that you are hitting uphill, but the ball is below your feet. So for a right-handed golfer, standing facing the ball the ground is sloping down away from you, and from right to left the ground is sloping up in front of you. Probably more common in hilly or mountainous areas, because I sure haven't encountered such a lie here in Florida, at least not with enough uphill slope to affect my swing. Mostly I am concerned about the ball above or below my feet, unless I'm on a mound and my stance is such that one foot is more elevated than the other. I've had to get down on my knee on the uphill leg, with my downhill leg straight out and foot dug in to brace and keep me on the mound. The ball was just sitting there and I wondered what freak force of gravity was keeping it on the hill. No way to advance the ball a great distance, and swing is all arms in that position. One of those shots you can't really practice, you just have to improvise and hope for the best!
Inconsistent!! Your probably correct that Florida doesn't have any side hills!! If you would like to see some, come to Alabama...we may even give you a couple to take home. But, they and a few other obsticales make for a good day on the course.
Inconsistent!! Your probably correct that Florida doesn't have any side hills!! If you would like to see some, come to Alabama...we may even give you a couple to take home. But, they and a few other obsticales make for a good day on the course.
I would love to come up and play the Trail! I wish I had been playing golf when I was living up in L.A. (lower Alabama - Florida Panhandle), because then it was only 2-4 hours up to some nice "hilly" courses. I was up in Northeast Georgia a couple of weeks ago, and passed a course in the mountains there that looked like fun. Never saw an entrance or any indication of what the course was, but from the road I was on I could see a tee box and the green was probably 300 feet higher - looked like a par 4, and the fairway had various "levels". Hard to describe, but sure looked like fun! The carts must have been 4 wheel drive!
Build or imagine yourself making the following apparatus. You will need a flat, wide object, like a piece of cardboard, and 4 objects of all the same height, like say soda cans.
Place all four cans on the floor underneath the four corners of the cardboard. Now you've got a flat lie, right? Imagine yourself (as a right hand golfer) standing on the line between the bottom left and top left cans. The ball would be between the top right and bottom right cans.
Now, take the bottom right can out and place it on top of the top right can. You, the golfer, and the ball stayed in the same spot. You are standing on a slope that goes from 1 can high to 2 cans high ... uphill. The ball is lying on a slope that goes from 0 cans high to 1 can high ... uphill. But since you are on 1-2 and the ball is on 0-1, you are above the ball, or in other words the ball is below your feet.
Voila, the uphill, ball below your feet lie. Go find a hill in your backyard or nearby park, and I am sure you can find such a situation.
Forget the sidehill part for a moment. Keep it simple. You have uphill lies, and downhill lies. The most significant elements of those two differing lies requires two things: (1) Setting up WITH the slope of the ground (in other words, keeping your shoulders level with the slope of the ground). (2) Thoughtful consideration of club selection.
Typical downhill lies normally require less club. Why? Because the angle of the slope that the ball rests on isn't flat, and the angles change. Your center of gravity changes. That's is why you should always play downhill lies further back in your stance, to account for the difference in your center of gravity (or the bottoming out point in your swing). And generally speaking, you should take less club, once again because of the angle at impact. A typical 8iron that impacts the ball on a downhill lie actually has the effective loft of a 7iron, or maybe even a 6iron depending on the severity of the slope. And remember, if you're setup is proper, your shoulders will mirror the same level as that of the slope you're hitting from.
Uphill lies -- one concept stays the same -- your setup. Shoulders level with the ground. The other concept is completely different, however. Your ball is sitting on an up-slope, not a down-slope. The 8iron example I used earlier -- with this lie, the effective loft with this shot using an 8iron is more realistically the loft of a 9iron (maybe even a wedge, depending once again on the severity of the slope). That means less distance, because the club is already impacting the ball at a higher loft angle.
So in essence, the uphill-downhill lie revolves around distance and proper club selection.
Now the sidehill part. Sidehills do not have nearly the impact on distance, but more on direction. Sidehill lies where the ball is below your feet -- expect the ball to fade (or slice). Factor that in with your setup, and account for more left-to-right movement if you're a righty, and right-to-left movement if you're a lefty. The amount you open your setup to account for this naturally depends on the severity of the slope. The more sidehill the lie is, the more you should open your stance to account for it.
If the ball is above your feet, do the exact opposite of what you would do playing the ball being below your feet. You actually close your stance, as opposed to opening it, to account for the right-to-left movement for righties, and left-to-right movement for lefties. Once again, the more that the ball is above your feet, the more you need to account for movement.
In both instances, club selection is vital. But looking at both concepts individually (uphill versus downhill) and sidehill (ball above your feet or below it) helps keep things simple. One has more of an influence on distance, the other on direction. Applying these concepts together should help you figure out what to expect, and how to account for them.
December 16th, 2006, 02:27 AM
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