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i make a full turn and thewn to start my downswing i begin with my arms dropping down and try to hold back my body. i read this tip form luke donald and it has helped me recover from my weak shots off the toe i was hitting.

is this normal or should the first move from the top be with the hips opening?

Don't pay any attention to me, johnny, but I've always read that the hips should initiate the downswing. However, the sequence of events is so fast as to make the beginning of the hip turn, the shoulder turn, and the right elbow dropping to the hip bone almost simutaneous. I don't believe that consciously trying to sequence these moves is very helpful. Put yourself in the correct position at the top, and let gravity take care of the rest.

my problem is that i maybe turn my hips too quickly and throw them open. i'm sure the hips need to but maybe before i was turning and leaving my hands to play catch up?

i dunno. strange game!

[quote=johnny trance]my problem is that i maybe turn my hips too quickly and throw them open. i'm sure the hips need to but maybe before i was turning and leaving my hands to play catch up?

There are different types of moves for differet body types and personalities but it sounds like you are right on regarding your swing and the change you made was correct ("I begin with my arms dropping down and try to hold back my body"). But know that valeogut is correct you are doing what he says but you are timing things better.

I am a teaching professional and I had a similar problem as you back in the 70's. Back then every teacher was taking people like me with long legs and teaching dramatic leg drive, I ended up overdoing the foward hip turn. I had to think of the very same things you are doing but when you see me on camera my forward swing is started by the hips but it is subdued and quiet, you will end up doing the same just never over do and completely stop your hip turn think of it as:

A QUIET WEIGHT SHIFT on to the front foot as you "let your
arms drop this will always help to connect the body move with the arms.

cool stuff.

i am tall and lanky and have lopng legs. the tend to get over active and it hurts my ball striking when i am out of sink.

Most people around 6' and over should have less lower body just for the reasons you state.

I am 6'1'' and have loping legs, too. I call that "getting ahead of the ball" and usually that leads to one of two things: block it out to the right....or attempt to overcorrect - the hands can't catch up so I smother it over the top and the ball goes straight left. It's also common to "dump" the right side. I just think of keeping my thighs and knees facing forward (perpendicular to target line) as long as I can before releasing them. The first move, for rh golfers, should be the right elbow moving closer to the body...I like to imagine my hands meeting up with the left thigh upon impact and then gracefully release and face the target. It's hard to keep from leading with the knees. It's counterintuitive to be facing 90º to the direction you're intending to send the ball. But when I do, it sure goes straight.

Shade

The hips and lower body should start the downswing...not by turning but more like sliding to the target. This is the only way the club will get on the correct inside out swing plaine and produce those crips shots...the more you try to start the downswing with the arms the more problems you will probably cause with coming over the top.

I agree with golfdiva.

The object of any move at the top of the back swing is to move the weight quietly onto the inside of the leading foot. Some people think of it as a lateral movement but this often moves the centre off the line of the ball. For most people the sense is of the hips moving forward as the weight changes from the right pivot to the left. But the center of the body should stay pretty well where it was at address with the weight on the inside of the left foot or at least not on the outside. Some research on very long drivers shows that there is still more weight on the right foot at impact, so too quick a shift of weight may be counter productive. The swing has two pivot points but one centre and this must stay effectively behind the ball at impact to generate the power that is required. Thus the head remains in place long after the arms, hands and club have gone through the ball. In fact the better swingers have their heads back of the initial address position on impact. But the left side is still the limit of the forward move.