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He ran Shaq and Phil off. Why not Karl?

It's kind of surprising to hear because I thought I remembered hearing Karl was one of his biggest supporters last year. Of course, last year's event may have shown that Kobe isn't exactly the stand up guy everyone thought he was.

Well, if the question is, who is the better teammate for Shaq, things get a little tougher. Even though Kobe and Shaq didn't get along very well, it's hard to argue with the rings they have. To this point, Wade and Shaq haven't accomplished much but they certainly seem to be getting along fine.

what did he say?

He said...

"It's not really fair to hold it over the guys' heads that are here," Bryant said. "The guys that we have here are working hard, practicing hard every day. It's kind of tough for them to be looking over their shoulder, wondering if he's going to come back and then everybody is going to disappear.
"They are here giving me 110 percent. It's really not fair for us to sit around and speculate how long this is going to go on. I mean, you can't sit up here and speculate for the remainder of the season whether or not he is going to come back. I mean, that's not fair to the guys that are working here."


Now Karl doesnt want anything to do with Kobe, and their relationship is supposidely non-existant... this is a dude that was Kobe's biggest supporter when no one else on his team was supporting him. He even said he would rather sacrifice his championship so Kobe can go free...
Dude, now that I see the poll again, I would rather have Wade.. even though I still think Kobe's a better player right now... Wade seems like a decent human being who can also play the lights out, whereas Kobe's always only out for himself... (ie. trying to implicate Shaq when he was detained, running off the winningest coach in history and the most dominant player in history, now running off the best PF in history..)

I think Kobe's wearing out his image amongst LA fans these days..

what is this 50/50?

The "most dominant player in history" I assume you're referring to Shaq here.....You've got to be joking, or very young. A guy by the name of Wilt Chamberlain dominated the NBA like no other player ever has. Yeah, Shag is today's premier big man but what he's doing today is not even close to what "Wilt the Stilt" did to the game. Even MJ and the way he changed the game didn't come close to being the dominating figure that Chamberlain was.

Wilt was dominant, but how many championships did he have? one.. domination usually = wins..

plus guys back then werent near what they are now, and shaq still finds a way to get it done.... sure rules were changed cuz of wilt, but those same rules would have changed cuz of shaq later on if they hadnt for wilt..

wilt did dominate in one category though... 2,000 is an impressive number....

not 50/50, its two different stories completely. I think most ppl agreed that Kobe is the better player now, which is what i stated in my first post. IMO, there isnt even a debate about who is better right now....
This last post was about Kobe's selfish attitude that has people all around the league questioning his character...especially in light of what he said about Malone..

BUT
this doesnt change the fact that Kobe is one of the best and premier players in the league, if not the best...

thus, who is better? Kobe
who would you rather have on your team? Wade

If winning championships makes you dominant.....beware of the Steve Kerrs of the league. It's always difficult to compare players of different eras but look at Wilt's career stats and compare them to Shaq's....you can't, because there is no comparison. Shaq also doesn't play against the greatest basketball TEAMS of all time....the Bill Russell led Boston Celtics. Better yet, Wilt is still considered the second greatest player of all time behind MJ. Where does Shaq come in on that list? Shaq is dominant but he's no where near being considered as the best player ever.

50/50 look at the poll results... thats what i meant by it...

I think everyone would agree that championships equal greatness. Sure Steve Kerr won 5,and so did Horry, but what were they? The role players... Who did they win them with? MJ, Shaq, Kobe, Robinson, Duncan... any one of whom could dominate a game at any given moment...Its the dominant players we're talking about, not the role players..

Wilt's career stats are impressive, except that hes done it against players half his size... Would any player now that's 7-1 be nicknamed, the stilt? No, of course not, because that is the norm now... The rules back then also made it so defenders couldnt double team Wilt or zone him...Whens the last time you saw Shaq without two defenders hanging all over him....Shaq plays against players that are better, more athletic, and in some cases, taller.... he faces double and triple teams EVERY time he touches the ball.. and yet he still finds ways to dominate games. Imagine Shaq with no double teams... Would any team be able to stop him?

Wilt reputation back then was that he was a quitter, and could never perform on the big stage. Yeah, he scored 100 in a game, but what was his career playoff avg? 22 or so.. his career scoring avg? 30.. 8 points less per game when it really matters.

Dr Jack, who coached against both Wilt and Russell, said hes never seen anyone as strong as Shaq, and that includes Mr. 20,000.

Wilt at second greatest all time? You must have forgotten about Magic, Bird, and th rest...Would MJ be the greatest ever without the championships? Or even if he just got one? No, the 3 in the row did it, and the next three solidified it. Wilt won his championships as a 4th option player who just rebounded.

In that case, Yeah.. I like your new avator btw..

You were mistaken about "the rules back then" and you made my point about Wilt.....nobody was better, more athletic, or taller. That's why he dominated so much more so than Shaq. Averaging 50 points and 25 rebounds a game for an entire season (despite being double and triple teamed) plus being the defensive factor in the middle, made Wilt a force that Shag will never be.

I'm not making this stuff up....heres the link

http://www.nba.com/history/players/c...n_summary.html

Wilt Chamberlain

He was basketball's unstoppable force, the most awesome offensive force the game has ever seen. Asked to name the greatest players ever to play basketball, most fans and aficionados would put Wilt Chamberlain at or near the top of the list. Dominating the game as few players in any sport ever have, Chamberlain seemed capable of scoring and rebounding at will, despite the double- and triple-teams and constant fouling tactics that opposing teams used to try to shut him down. As Oscar Robertson put it in the Philadelphia Daily News when asked whether Chamberlain was the best ever, "The books don't lie." more...

Full Name: Wilton Norman Chamberlain
Born: 8/21/36 in Philadelphia
Died: 10/12/99 in Los Angeles
High School: Overbrook (Philadelphia)
College: Kansas
Drafted by: Philadelphia Warriors (1959)
Transactions: Traded to Philadelphia 76ers,
1/15/65; Traded to Los Angeles Lakers, 7/9/68 Nickname: WIlt the Stilt; The Big Dipper
Height: 7-1; Weight: 275 lbs.
Honors: Elected to Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame (1978); NBA champion (1967, '72); NBA Finals MVP (1972); NBA MVP (1960, '66, '67, '68); All-NBA First Team (1960, '61, '62, '64, '66, '67, '68); Second Team ('63, '65, '72); All-Defensive First Team (1972, '73); Rookie of Year (1960); One of the 50 Greatest Players in NBA History (1996).

Great info league. Averaging over 30 points and 20 boards a game, now that's impressive. Especially with that 51.1% FT shooting.

Wilt was notorious for changing the way he shot free throws. He sometimes shot them one handed from just inside the back of the free throw circle and at the end of his career he was shooting them underhanded ala Rick Barry. I ran into Wilt (literally)at Cobo Arena in the early 70's before a game with the Pistons.

Comparing Shaq's numbers to Wilt's numbers is really one sided but even that doesn't tell the whole story. I've never heard anyone (other than trudat) refer to Chamberlain as a "quitter." His records and the comments from his teammates and foes alike, say otherwise.