someinfidel, I think if you look at Tiger's record, he either wins or finishes 15th or worse in majors. In some of high finishes he's had, he's simply not gotten the job done. Against Rich Beem at the PGA in 2002, Tiger waited until the final 4 holes to make his run (birdied all 4)...it was already too late by that point because Beem did not choke. In the 2003 British Open, Tiger simply did not make a putt on the back nine...the tourney was HIS for the taking and he just didn't grab it. Instead, Ben Curtis made his putts and won the tournament.
You're proving my point...If Tiger was in their heads, Rich Beam would have choked and Ben Curtis would have realized that he can't beat Tiger and wouldn't have the nerves to make those putts.
But anyhow if you look at his record in the Majors, which is amazing... you also see he was 3rd in 1999 at Pinehurst, when Payne Stewart won the US Open, also that year he was 7th at the Open, in 2000 he was 6 strokes away from the grand slam in 5th at the Masters... he had top 10s in the Masters and the British in 1998 too...
Tiger played some great golf in the first round too, I mean yeah he shot 74, but he putted it into the water and, how 'bout that flagstick shot into the bunker. All in all he played very well all week and earned the win, no doubt. But he did it by outplaying the competition not intimidating them
To a certain extent I'm proving you're point...but what about the majors that Phil, Vijay, Ernie, and Goosen have won? Tiger was nowhere near making a charge. Completely out of it on the back nine. My point is that it takes the "little guy" to stand up to Tiger. The other big names have choked any time Tiger has played well in a major. I guess it's the same for them too though. A majority of the time that the top guys are playing well (2004 Masters for example) Tiger is struggling. More of Tiger's wins came against top competition (meaning the top 10 golfers in the ranking) than the COMBINED wins of Els, Mickelson, Goosen, Weir, Toms, and Singh. Just look at Tiger's finishes in each of their major victories. Some of the wins by these guys were against each other, but they still didn't prove that they could beat Tiger because he was nowhere to be found back in the pack. But then look at some of Tiger's duels:
Sergio a couple of times (1999 PGA and 2002 US Open)
Phil a couple of times (2001 Masters and 2002 US Open)
Ernie a couple of times (2001 and 2002 Masters)
Singh completely chokes when Tiger is in the lead and I can't think of one major where Singh actually stepped up to the plate to challenge Tiger during a major.
Tiger was 5th at the 2000 Masters that Vijay won... Tiger was the only player to shoot in the 60s both days on the weekend. He wasn't right there, but that's probably the only one...
The fact is the big guys haven't won a lot of majors. Phil has the 1, I think Els and Vijay have 3 each. and 2 of those 6 are before Tiger tuned pro. So Tiger had 5 chances to mix it up when those guys won... But like you said he didn't give them a good run at it. All I know is I'm looking forward to the Opens this year, hopefully all the big names will bring their best games and we will have another good show
when Woods shows up for 4 rounds, the other big names show up for 3 rounds and choke. But when they show up for 4 rounds, Tiger struggles for a majority of the tourney (or has one terrible round that completely knocks him out of it like Ernie's win at the 2002 British Open).
The guy that puts up four good rounds usually wins the Majors. Rarely can anyone shoot over par for a round and still win these days.
Apparently, Tiger can. ...and let's not forget that he shot 40 in 1997 on his first nine of his first round. 4 over after nine holes and lights it up the rest of the way...that's something I don't think anyone else (not even Jack) could come close to pulling off.
Apparently, Tiger can. ...and let's not forget that he shot 40 in 1997 on his first nine of his first round. 4 over after nine holes and lights it up the rest of the way...that's something I don't think anyone else (not even Jack) could come close to pulling off.
Tiger still shot under par for that round in '97 didn't he? That's because Jack never had to overcome a 40!
Yes, he shot under par, thanks to that nice little 30! LOL. Jack didn't win by 12 including the 40 did he? By the way, I'm just curious...not sure if you know this or not, but I'll ask it anyway since I have no clue on this issue. What was Jack's biggest margin of victory at Augusta? Thanks for answering.
Yes, he shot under par, thanks to that nice little 30! LOL. Jack didn't win by 12 including the 40 did he? By the way, I'm just curious...not sure if you know this or not, but I'll ask it anyway since I have no clue on this issue. What was Jack's biggest margin of victory at Augusta? Thanks for answering.
Right now Jack's biggest margin of victory at Augusta is 2. That's 6 for him and 4 for Arnie and Tiger! Who cares how many a guy wins by? That just tells me the other players may have played poorly. The least important stat in any major is how many strokes the winner won by. Yes, Tiger's victory margin has been impressive at times. Unimportant, but impressive.
I'm not sure of Jack's biggest margin of victory either but I'd guess it was probably when he set the Masters scoring record.
I mentioned it in the other thread, but Jack won by 9 in 1965 over Arnie and Gary I believe.
Cool. Thanks for telling me. Pretty nice blowout there...I guess league will say that Gary and Arnie played poorly in that one eh? **** When Tiger won by 15 at the US Open, those players weren't playing poorly...he was just playing off-the charts unreal. When you're the only one under par, I don't think that it means the other guys are playing poorly, just that the golf course is very difficult and only one guy is able to handle it (be it because he's more talented or tougher, etc). But yes, Jack is definitely the best right now and I definitely think Sam Snead was absolutely one of the top 3 or 4 of all-time. Has anyone else seen the Celebrity Golf shows that he was on? They come on the Golf Channel (or used to anyway...I haven't been able to watch the Golf Channel since Christmas since Texas Tech's cable package doesn't include TGC. ) Anyway, that show is pretty cool and Sam was definitely a good ol' guy.
Oops...got confused about which thread I was on...LOL...the Sam Snead part was meant for another thread.
Last edited by leaguegolf : April 11th, 2005 at 01:40 AM.
Reason: Inappropriate Comment
Cool. Thanks for telling me. Pretty nice blowout there...I guess league will say that Gary and Arnie played poorly in that one eh?
That was just making light of your fascination with how many Tiger wins by. It's totally irrelevant and I think Tiger would tell you the same thing. Sure, it looks good to win by a large margin, but the bottom line is winning. It doesn't matter if it's by one stroke or ten. Dominance is 18 majors. Not winning by the most strokes in a few majors.
DiMarco did not fall apart in the final round today. He definitely gave Tiger a run for his money especially on the Back 9. Most of the time the pressure was actually on Tiger because when Tiger would do well on a hole, Chris would answer right back and stay fairly close to Tiger. As far as I can tell, DiMarco did not look intimidated at all during the final 18.
I agree that he did a very good job of holding his own in the final round. When I wrote this post it was after they finished their 3rd round nine in the
morning where he did fall apart. awesome tournament to watch, especially since I thought tiger was going to run away with it.
Help me out on this one....everyone knows Jack had 18 major wins, but I think I remember reading that he has something like 20 second place major finishes as well...now that is playing some golf.
I think he had 18 wins, 19 seconds and 9 thirds...but I'm not 100% sure on those numbers. I'm pretty sure he had 46 top 3s total so those numbers look about right.
April 10th, 2005, 11:31 PM
Yes, Tiger's victory margin has been impressive at times. Unimportant, but impressive.
) Anyway, that show is pretty cool and Sam was definitely a good ol' guy. 
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